mike_fla
Rookie Author
Florida
Posts:1
Points:20,845
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Message Posted: Apr 16, 2012 10:21:15 PM
I just purchased a Chrysler 200.. Of course I can use E85 fuel. After reading many of the threads it appears that no gas mileage loss was noticed.. I haven't been so lucky.. Though the car seem to accelerate better.. My gas mileage dropped to 19 in the city from 26.. I drive the same distance and way everyday.. Wondering why some are saying they are getting better or at least the same.. Ideas anyone?
[Edited by: mike_fla at 4/16/2012 10:22:34 PM EST]
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cheapmonkee
Champion Author
Portland
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Message Posted: Apr 16, 2012 1:15:46 AM
Only occasionally I blend in some e85. Usually, I fill with e10 and then come back after about 90 miles and fill with e85. Just a couple times a year for system cleaning. MPG results don't differ much +-
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aRBy
Veteran Author
Grand Rapids
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Message Posted: Apr 15, 2012 11:45:28 PM
Most cars built after 2002 will run E85 without problem. I know people who have run cars built after 2002 exclusively on E85 with no problem. That does not mean you will be so lucky.
If you want to run E85 and your car is not listed and/or warrantied for it, use it sparingly.
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jamieg2012
Veteran Author
Sioux Falls
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Message Posted: Apr 10, 2012 12:55:26 PM
banjoe
the problem with excel is it is only as good as the math you program the cells to do
this person thinks miles per tank is the right math and it really is not
with miles per tank you do not know how many gallons is left when you do fill up and this quarter tank left thing is not accurate as filling up and see you bought 9 gallons before the pump clicked off
if you use wrong math and data collection methods then your data will be way off no matter what kind of computer program you use
[Edited by: jamieg2012 at 4/10/2012 12:56:19 PM EST]
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reb4
Champion Author
Chicago
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Message Posted: Apr 10, 2012 8:44:03 AM
jamieg2012, Con garage???
Finding a good mechanic is tough...
Finding a good mechanic that is honest is tougher.
Finding a good mechanic that is honest and reasonably prices is really a find...
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Banjoe
Champion Author
Winnipeg
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Message Posted: Apr 10, 2012 7:55:11 AM
I'm still not sure what happens when using E85 in a non-E85 vehicle but it's pretty clear that discussing the topic starts a lot of heated opinions and even excel slapdowns.
Pretty interesting side bars from some of the junior participants.
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jamieg2012
Veteran Author
Sioux Falls
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Message Posted: Apr 10, 2012 1:34:29 AM
katie
i do not go to con garages
the things dealers try to tell people makes the pattern of being cons
it was a comment on the mechanic that posted about all the damage and cost to fix it
that posts sounds like a con garage
[Edited by: jamieg2012 at 4/10/2012 1:35:31 AM EST]
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katie3148
Rookie Author
Indiana
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Message Posted: Apr 9, 2012 10:04:32 PM
Matt,
Just offering my opinion and experiance on the subject.I have probably worked on more cars and trucks in a week than you have in you entire life!!!
Just sharing a little info. I also said that the dealer bill would be around 2000.00! What I didn't say was that I thought it was right. I have no control over what the dealer charges.
Jamie...
Sounds like you need a new mechanic..One that can sleep at night after her or she fixes you car. Not every mechanic is our to rip off people.
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jamieg2012
Veteran Author
Sioux Falls
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Message Posted: Apr 8, 2012 2:08:36 PM
i also see patterns of dealers taking advantage of people that really know nothing about a car
they use the so you do not know what a gas cap is so now we can charge for a rebuild and not just a couple spark plugs but only give you spark plugs with a bill of over 2000
i see a con garage
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mr157ifhz
Sophomore Author
Gasbuddy
Posts:155
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Message Posted: Apr 8, 2012 1:10:17 PM
The auto industry stopped using rubber in the fuel system a long time ago. Anything since is viton, neoprene, or plastic and compatable with ethanol.
I would be very suspicious of a dealer charging $2000+ to replace a fuel pump and anything 'rubber'
-Matt
[Edited by: mr157ifhz at 4/8/2012 1:15:06 PM EST]
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katie3148
Rookie Author
Indiana
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Points:330
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Message Posted: Apr 7, 2012 11:15:02 PM
As a ford dealer mechanic for 20 plus years. I can tell you I have seen several cars come in on the tow truck after the customer has mistakenly used E85 in a non flex fuel car. The result is a 2000.00 plus bill for fuel pump and anything with rubber. The fuel and rubber do not mix it causes the rubber to swell and become mushy, starving the engine for fuel and eventually causing a no start concern.
As for a carburated car the carb,pump and lines would have to be changed to run E85.
We have seen E85 run in drag racing cars with great sucess. They even have a class for E85 cars that regularly run 8 seconds in the 1/4 mile at speeds of 160 mph.
This fuel performs similar to 110 octane or 118 octane fuel but with less cost.
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jamieg2012
Veteran Author
Sioux Falls
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Message Posted: Apr 6, 2012 12:23:39 PM
mr157ifhz does have good points but
i would still do the 2 0r 3 gallon test and not just fill up just in case for some reason your computer does not adjust for the mix then there is room to dilute down to what the computer does adjust for
i also see the same fuel pump and fuel filter clogging with people that do run e0 all the time but think sea foam is ok to use
in cars with high enough mileage changing filters a lot at first is really a good thing since you now get all that gunk out and no gunk makes the system run more efficient when all clean
i actually run e30 and doing just fine even have more power when going up hills compared to when i used e10
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mr157ifhz
Sophomore Author
Gasbuddy
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Message Posted: Apr 6, 2012 11:57:42 AM
SilverStreaker says: "If you don't think that thermal efficiency is important, why don't you try running diesel fuel in your gasoline engine? Diesel fuel has a much higher energy content than gasoline."
What a great comment. Too bad the anti-ethanol crowd will ignore it. It makes too much of a mockery of one of their lynch-pin statements.
Ethanol truly is a remarkably versatile fuel. Not only can you run an engine designed to run gasoline on it, you can also power a diesel engine with it, or even a jet engine.
As others have said, try it and see. If your vehicle is 90's or newer, all your fuel system componants can handle ethanol. Would say this though, if all you've ever used is ethanol-free gasloline, your fuel system could be dirty. Change your fuel filter. Too many have just dumped in E85, and when they get plugged filters or injectors, they blame the ethanol.
-Matt
[Edited by: mr157ifhz at 4/6/2012 12:04:01 PM EST]
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DecILTattleTale
Champion Author
Illinois
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Message Posted: Apr 6, 2012 7:52:54 AM
I'd THINK it would still run, just not as well.
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jamieg2012
Veteran Author
Sioux Falls
Posts:286
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 12:26:28 PM
the only thing that can happen is if your computer does not adjust for the mix then it will run rough
it is the running rough that causes problems if you just try to drive it out and ethanol is not the problem
even a faulty sensor can cause a car to run rough on e0 by giving the computer wrong info about the gas
just take the tank to about empty - quarter tank is not enough so you have to be like 1 gallon left and go and only put in 2 or 3 gallons e85 then run it and see what you get
if it runs rough or you get a check engine error code then go directly back to the station and fill up the whole tank on e0 to dilute the ethanol
try looking up the lake area tech e85 study they did with the non flex tahoe - it was perfectly fine so if your computer adjusts for the mix then you will be fine as long as it is not a older car with things like the steel gas tank and cork gaskets
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SilverStreaker
Champion Author
Twin Cities
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 11:58:51 AM
antiguzzle says "Your using a fuel with less energy yet you are getting better gas mileage?You're either lying, or trolling or both."
Are you aware that the energy content of liquid fuels is a value of how much the fuel can raise the temperature of water, as measured in a bomb calorimeter? Are you aware that the energy output of an engine depends on the energy input (fuel) AND the Thermal Efficiency?
If you don't think that thermal efficiency is important, why don't you try running diesel fuel in your gasoline engine? Diesel fuel has a much higher energy content than gasoline.
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gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 11:25:33 AM
antiguzzle...don't you have a job? And if you do have a job...do they let you post from work?
[Edited by: gamechanger2011 at 4/2/2012 11:28:10 AM EST]
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antiguzzle
Sophomore Author
Wichita
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 10:58:18 AM
"Now I run straight E85 in it and still get higher mpg than E10 gasoline."
Your using a fuel with less energy yet you are getting better gas mileage?You're either lying, or trolling or both.
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antiguzzle
Sophomore Author
Wichita
Posts:237
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 10:55:48 AM
Other than your gas mileage going to absolute ####, if your car is under warranty and anything happens to it that could be traced to your fuel use.. you will be footing the bill.
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gamechanger2011
Champion Author
Wichita
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 10:49:43 AM
CaptDave...we usually provide links to back up our claims. Do you have any?
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CaptDave2012
All-Star Author
Arkansas
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 10:47:59 AM
Really bad things.
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goldseeker
Champion Author
West Virginia
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 7:37:18 AM
You've got it James.
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James48843
Veteran Author
Michigan
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 7:17:36 AM
Sure are a lot of responses in this thread from people who don't have a clue what they are talking about, isn't there?
No, if your car is not a flex-fuel car, then you should not be running E85 in it. However,the fact is that about E30 mix works just fine in any car made in the last 25 years. Just sayin'.
Anything above an E50 mix, and you are likely to get a "lean burn" condition and a "check engine" light. Running E85 long term in a non-flex, and you may end up with a fuel pump problem as well, if the pump is not large enough to handle the increased demand.
That's about it.
No, your gonads won't fall off (LOL).
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WE0H
Champion Author
Twin Cities
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 3:29:02 AM
First test of E85 blend in a 80k mile 2002 Escort ZX-2. I have 200 miles on the odo and the gauge says 3/4th tank :) This is looking good to get a 40+ mpg tank average. Running 3 gallons E85 and 11 gallons 87 octane E10 gas. Next fill up will be 4 gallons E85 & 10 gallons 87 E10 gas. BTW, my wife is driving on this tank. She normally gets 30 mpg max with her heavy right foot. Last summer I had to work the hell out of the car to get it to 40 mpg on 89 octane E10 gas and got one tank at 45 mpg & the other at 46 mpg but that was some serious work to do that. This E85 blend is absolute normal driving around the Twin Cities area.
This test is turning out the same as I found blending in my Vue V6 last summer. Now I run straight E85 in it and still get higher mpg than E10 gasoline. BTW the Vue is a 10:1 cr Honda motor and the ZX-2 is at 9.7:1. Higher compression motors tolerate E85 very well. It's those low compression motors that get bad mpg on E85 blends or straight E85.
To all those haters, do some real tests yourselves rather than spreading Internet stories that are totally false. E85 works and it is saving me a bunch of cash on each fill up :)
[Edited by: WE0H at 4/2/2012 3:30:33 AM EST]
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BobD2009
Champion Author
Long Island
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Message Posted: Apr 2, 2012 12:41:09 AM
Abolish ethanol now.
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SilverStreaker
Champion Author
Twin Cities
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Message Posted: Apr 1, 2012 11:43:32 PM
I have been using ethanol blends in my two non-FFVs for over 2 years with no performance or maintenance problems. I have not seen any significant change in MPGs, so I save money every time I buy E85.
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furball64801
Champion Author
Missouri
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Message Posted: Feb 7, 2012 9:51:22 AM
Puddingpal with all do respect, carb in cars when was the last time they built a car with a carb in it. Lets see I have had three cars and they all run on a 60% mix plus of ethanol and two of them have run over 5 yrs on them till the tornado in Joplin destroyed one of them. So no fuel pump replacement and for sure no carb problems because they do not use carbs in the modern car.
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furball64801
Champion Author
Missouri
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Message Posted: Feb 7, 2012 9:46:54 AM
You know most cars do not even use carbs any longer thats old school. Still running a 60% plus E-85 mix in my 2005 Pt Cruiser and still no repairs of any kind. All I know is it works for me, on the highway and that is what I gauge it on I get close to 25 mph love the stuff and I get a good .40 price break and at times up to .50 so for me it is well worth it.
[Edited by: furball64801 at 2/7/2012 9:48:12 AM EST]
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rhail2
Champion Author
Kentucky
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Message Posted: Feb 5, 2012 1:08:22 PM
thats not good
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emtrob2012
All-Star Author
Myrtle Beach
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Message Posted: Feb 5, 2012 8:57:39 AM
i dont trust e85...
and also...it would mean less MPG
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goldseeker
Champion Author
West Virginia
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Message Posted: Feb 5, 2012 3:30:54 AM
"The ethanol would swell the rubber in their fuel systems and destroy its ability to operate. We would then have to replace carburetors and fuel pumps all the time.'
That is pure BS. According to Cole Palmer's Compatibility chart ethanol has and excellent rating with rubber. To use this chart just scroll down until you find natural rubber and then on the other column scroll down until you find alcohol, ethyl. You will be surprised at the result.
I am truly amazed how many folks use ethanol as a scape goat for anything that goes wrong in a car, even those who claim to be mechanics.
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rhail2
Champion Author
Kentucky
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Message Posted: Feb 4, 2012 11:52:05 AM
thats not good
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moe81272NH
All-Star Author
New Hampshire
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Message Posted: Feb 4, 2012 5:26:38 AM
not too good
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GM1954
Champion Author
Illinois
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Message Posted: Feb 3, 2012 9:26:12 PM
"We would then have to replace carburetors and fuel pumps all the time."
/a carburetor? How many cars in the past 25 years have been made with a carburetor?
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PuddinPal
Champion Author
California
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Message Posted: Feb 3, 2012 9:07:59 PM
I worked in the auto repair industry before retiring recently. We would get any number of vehicles in that were running poorly or not running at all. The ethanol would swell the rubber in their fuel systems and destroy its ability to operate. We would then have to replace carburetors and fuel pumps all the time. Do yourself a favor and don't use it in an older vehicle.
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hailsupersport
Champion Author
Cincinnati
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Message Posted: Feb 3, 2012 8:27:55 AM
not good
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moe81272NH
All-Star Author
New Hampshire
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Message Posted: Feb 3, 2012 3:23:23 AM
not good
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thebrohta167
Champion Author
New Jersey
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Message Posted: Feb 1, 2012 3:28:52 PM
bad
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Cummins2500
Champion Author
Iowa
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Message Posted: Feb 1, 2012 2:51:05 PM
Here is what one manufacture has to say, below its from a 2011 owners manual about using E85 in a non FFV/non E85 vehicle:
=====================================================
Gasoline/Oxygenate Blends Some fuel suppliers blend unleaded gasoline with oxygenates such as Ethanol. Fuels blended with oxygenates
may be used in your vehicle.
Problems that result from using gasoline containing Methanol or gasoline containing more than 10% Ethanol are not the responsibility of the manufacturer and may not be covered under warranty.
E-85 Usage In Non-Flex Fuel Vehicles:
Non-FFV vehicles are compatible with gasoline containing 10% ethanol (E10). Gasoline with higher ethanol content may void the vehicle’s warranty. If a Non-FFV vehicle is inadvertently fueled with E-85
fuel, the engine will have some or all of these symptoms:
• operate in a lean mode
• OBD II “Malfunction Indicator Light” on
• poor engine performance
• poor cold start and cold driveability
• increased risk for fuel system component corrosion
To fix a Non-FFV vehicle inadvertently fueled once with E-85 perform the following:
• change the engine oil and oil filter
• disconnect and reconnect the battery
• drain the fuel tank (see your authorized dealer)
More extensive repairs will be required for prolonged exposure to E-85 fuel.
[Edited by: Cummins2500 at 2/1/2012 2:52:21 PM EST]
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GBHUGVA
Champion Author
Virginia Beach
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Message Posted: Feb 1, 2012 9:40:14 AM
Vapor-lock in Hot weather
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furball64801
Champion Author
Missouri
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Message Posted: Jan 3, 2012 7:59:11 PM
Cornhick you have no clue, I have run 3 cars on strong ethanol mix and no repairs on them. The Pt Cruiser up to 80% several times and no issues so it can be done and I will for a very long time.
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ghostryder63
Rookie Author
Missouri
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Message Posted: Jan 2, 2012 9:55:31 AM
I filled a 2003 Hyundai Sonata with E-85 quit by mistake and drove it at highway speeds for several hundred miles. The car ran great all the way but it did take out the Air Flow sensor. The car was not meant to burn E-85 so I did start to dilute the mix with gas as soon as I could. I wouldn't recommend it.
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goldseeker
Champion Author
West Virginia
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Message Posted: Jan 2, 2012 7:40:47 AM
Cornhick. You do not have a clue do you?
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CORNHICK
All-Star Author
Omaha
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Message Posted: Jan 2, 2012 2:16:07 AM
it will die a horrible death if you use e85 and dont have a converter
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rocky23hy
Champion Author
Massachusetts
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Message Posted: Jan 1, 2012 11:13:04 PM
Your wallet will shrink.
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goldseeker
Champion Author
West Virginia
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Message Posted: Jan 1, 2012 5:15:57 AM
For one thing, your oil will not get as dirty, and your spark plugs will stay cleaner for longer periods of time.
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prkuehn
Champion Author
Arkansas
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Message Posted: Jan 1, 2012 3:32:45 AM
You will not like the results.
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CORNHICK
All-Star Author
Omaha
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Message Posted: Dec 31, 2011 10:49:01 PM
makes your car destroy itself from the inside out
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goldseeker
Champion Author
West Virginia
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Message Posted: Dec 31, 2011 8:27:41 PM
"Your first concern will be all your plastics and rubbers. (gaskets seals hosing fuel lines filters lifter guides fuel pumps etc.."
"Ethanol is VERY aggressive toward plastic/rubber/resins"
Nerys. You simply do not have a clue. Ethanol has an excellent compatibility rating with rubber and most plastics and nearly all elastomers.
The same cannot be said of other common components of gasoline such as benzene, toulene, and xylene, as each has poor compatibility rating with plastics and rubber.
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furball64801
Champion Author
Missouri
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Message Posted: Dec 31, 2011 5:18:18 PM
I bought a 1995 Park Avenue and I am running a 30% mix right now, no issues and the gas mileage is the same. Can it run a higher mix, I do not see why not.
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